As most of you know I am a co-administrator over at Mars Hill Refuge. We worked on creating this petition with Stephanie Drury who runs Stuff Christian Culture Likes. A lot of people have been wondering why we focused on Mark’s views on sex and not his other more abusive or damaging views.
From Stephanie on our strategy;
"I met with social justice groups over the past week after news outlets have failed to pick up any of the spiritual abuse stories coming out of Mars Hill church. It's fucked up how Driscoll has a bestselling book on godly marriage while at the same time alarming stories from behind the scenes of his church have been coming out on sites like Jesus Needs New PR and Joyful Exiles. We've emailed major papers and news sites to ask them to spotlight the testimonies of insider experiences coming out of Mars Hill, andl the only one who would pick up the story was The Stranger. Not Christianity Today, not any of the Timeses type papers - no one.
So to raise curiosity about a problem (emotional and spiritual devastation coming out of Mars Hill church) that we have seen for years in our community and now spreading nationwide as Driscoll's fame and Acts 29 church network grows, we need to spark curiosity about what is happening behind the scenes. If demand is created then news outlets will cover these devastating stories of people who were once on the inner circle of Mars Hill church. Since Driscoll is a national bestseller and getting lots of media attention we decided to petition Liberty University to rescind their invite for Driscoll to speak on their campus on April 20th. We think that would get the conservatives and fundamentalists engaged as well. Once the truth is brought to light then healing can begin, as any survivor will tell you."
Liberty university is a fundamentalist institution. We felt the best way to capture their attention on the issue was to bring their attention to some of his more vulgar quotes on sex.
Personally, I don’t care about what he has to say on sex. I care about how he views a woman’s role in sex and marriage, and it frightens me that so many women are trying to live out his message, that they are quitting school to have babies and serve their husbands because Mark told them it was the right thing to do. I am concerned about the abusive stories coming from his church and I really just want to do whatever I can to try and limit his audience when he seems so hell bent on selling the world his version of the truth.
I'd be interested in your opinion of the following sermons, detailed in the links below. They deal with the roles of Christian husbands and wives, two different sermons in back to back weeks last year at ACC. I think it's important to highlight material in other local chuches that give a Biblical view on the topic and back it up with scrupture.
ReplyDeletehttp://amcc.org/sermons/2011/outlines/2011-11-06.pdf
http://amcc.org/sermons/2011/outlines/2011-11-13.pdf
You can also watch or listen to each of these sermons by clicking the link below and finding the sermon listed on the page.
http://amcc.org/sermons/2011/sermons_2011.asp
Can you elaborate on how you disagree with Driscoll's view on a woman's role in marriage? Can you post some links or quotes from the MH website where there are transcripts of sermons? ie http://marshill.com/media/real-marriage/sermons
ReplyDeleteI haven't read through all of them but am curious where the disagreements are more for my own understanding on where he stands.
I read through Driscoll's transcripted sermon from 1/29/12 for husbands and 2/05/12 for wives. What I've found so far, and please correct me if I'm wrong or have missed something, admittedly I skimmed through these, is that the material in his transcripts and the sermon notes from my chuch are essentially the same. Driscoll put's his own seasoning on it, makes some edgy statements about it, but all boiled down both are about wives respecting their husbands and submitting to them (thoroughly explaining that husbands are not to be the "boss" and order their wives around) and husbands loving their wives, as Christ loved the church.
ReplyDeleteMaybe these particular sermons aren't the issue, but as far as roles go, scripturally it seems sound. If theologically is where your disagreement lies, then that's another topic.
I'm sure I'm missing something though...
I would say it is not in what he says, it is the practical application. On paper it sounds like what you are saying, but in practice it is patriarchy.
ReplyDeleteWomen are told that they are sinning against their future husbands if they have to take out loans to go to college. Men are told that stay at home dads are subject to church discipline. There is so much more...You would have to spend some time watching various video clips on Youtube, and researching.
Here is a good compilation of links: http://skjaere.livejournal.com/706665.html
Thanks for the links
DeleteI think it is interesting that the sexual stuff isn't so important to you and a many others.
ReplyDeleteWe all come at this from different angles and I like knowing where other people come from.
My initial intro to Driscoll what his mishandling of the Song of Solomon, a book that I had been meditating on that has brought me spiritual healing. Yes, that's right. I said spiritual healing, not sexual healing.
Yep, I'm one of those crazy people that Driscoll openly mocks. I'm one of those that believes that the Song of Solomon, besides having a literal side, has a spiritual or allegorical side that can bring deep healing to a person's soul and spirit, because it has brought healing to me.
BUT, I know better than to try to get those who have sat under Driscoll's teaching to approach the book that way. Driscoll has found sex under every rock and tree and has taught other people about that alleged sex under every rock and tree. Anyone who has listen to his teaching (without any balancing from other teachings) will have a hard time seeing past all the sex and on into anything else that might be there. So I just let it go.
I said all that to say, the stuff he says about sex IS important to me. But it is just one of many things that is wrong with the Driscoll machine. And that's why I signed the petition.
Mara,
DeleteSorry I have taken so long to respond to this! The sex stuff is important to me, just less so than the abuse going on in his church, but the sexual stuff can be abuse as well, so at times it is very important to me.
I am no theologian, I haven't put much thought into what SOS is really about, but I definitely agree that Mark takes the sex stuff way to far. His solution seems to be way worse than the problem he imagines.
Hhmm. Perhaps the reason the sex stuff is so important to me, besides the defiling of SoS, is because of my perspective.
DeleteWhereas you have first hand experience of the immediate and overwhelming abuse of the chruch, I'm far removed from it. I can see it from afar, and in fact, had a pastor who was similar, as in very authoritarian. But what is affecting me personally is his teachings on sex and how it is infiltrating broader Christendom with his Peasant Princess series, and now his book on marriage.
You may not have time for this or you may just not be in the position to pursue this at this time, but I still want to make it available to you for any time, now or in the future, that you would care to look into it.
I think you are familiar with Wenatchee the Hatchet and his depth of understanding of the Bible and Driscoll?
He did a guest series on my blog concerning the Song of Solomon and Driscoll's take on it and on the possibility that perhaps Driscoll is wrong to say that it is only about all kinds of sex all the time. Like I said, you may not be in the position to pursue this. But if ever you would be able to, I wanted you to know that it's available.
http://frombitterwaterstosweet.blogspot.com/2011/10/wth-on-driscolls-sos-intro-pt-1.html